Anatomy + Frustration = help?

| - I feel like kicking myself in the head - |

AAAAAAAGH! I hate anatomy!
I sat down this morning to practice some, looked for some stock images and yadda yadda, you know the deal. BUT I HAVE NO IDEA WTF I'M DOING HALF OF THE TIME. Why?
I mean, do I HAVE to know all those little details about how the skeleton works and every goddamned little muscle twist and turn when we move around?

..man, if that's the case, I reeeaaally need a tutor or something.

And the annoying thing is that everybody says different. Some say "Just sit down and draw lots of bodies, it worked fine for me" while others say "You have to know the basics in anatomy - the skeleton and muscles etc.". Wtf? Where do I start? And what guidelines am I supposed to use?
I even bought two damn books on the subject and they're pretty much as indeep as anatomy books can get..

I suppose my impatience is getting the better of me, huh?

If someone has any sort of tips, tricks, hints, whatever... tell me? Cause I am so damn stuck I'm about to rip my own head off. It feels as if I'm not getting anywhere. I'm not improving and I want to know why.

You know why noone can help you? Cause art is grey. All people can do is give you advice and you just practice and that's art in a nut shell. Getting muscles right is all about drawing them alot and knowing where they sit.

My suggestions-

• Use referances with GOOD lighting. How do you know its good lighting? If you turn it into grey scale, it has even amounts of dark and light- not just grey. Oh- and don't get photo manips
• Don't start a picture thinking it'll take one hour. If what you do is 2 hours now, a referance shouldn't make it a quicker process. Spend 4 hours on it and make sure you understand why it does what it does.
• Don't drive yourself nuts just drawing random poses. They get boring. Find a pose you can fit to a scene and build it in. NEVER force yourself to draw. You wont put your full effort in.
• Find some good art books on human proportion. This one is an EXCILLENT book- I learnt how to draw from this book. Beware though- the art style is 1960s (it's been around THAT long- its a GOOD book), and it focuses on mostly 30+ humans- not teens. You'll have to figure out how to make them look younger. The drawing tuts in this book are the BEST I've ever found and I look at alot of art books.
• Lastly- Don't worry about how shit you think you are. Push yourself hard, and in 3 months time, if you can look at your old art and say "Hey look- I've improved!!" then it's mearly time before you're an awesome artist.

EVERYONE starts off like you. Just perceiver, and get better. Don't become a pro over night cause it wont happen. That's my suggestion

Yeah, thanks. T__T I just feel as if I can't get over that goddamned wall.

I'll just keep bumping my head against it until I break through it.. since I can't climb over it the quick way, right? (XD)

Anyway - yeah, thanks. I really appreciate it.

To be honest Jeica- sometimes to improve your art you need to look at what really bugs you and adress that insteed of what you think it is. See, I think your proportions look right to me. I seriously don't think its your issue. If you want critique on what does look wrong, then I think your next step is dynamics- not proportion. It may look out to you cause it may look mundane. You seem to draw a similar pose looking forward. Don't be too exciting on your first few, but try doing an action shot of someone running. Or doing a pose you've never tried before. Spend as long on it as you need. I think that is your answer- you have the basics. It's not biggie- you're alot further with art than alot of people are. IF you're at this point with art and STILL want to get better, then I know you have the drive to get action shots ^^ If I can do it, then so can you

Aah? Okay, I'll try that out then.. Hmm. Must get my hands on some good stock photos or something then.. or should I skip those? o_o

Anatomy is a big bugga boo with many artists, so you are not alone there.  I too struggle with it.  Stock photos do help, and there are some really good books out there specifically for artists for anatomy study.  Perhaps this web site may help you some too. http://www.posemaniacs.com/  Practice really does help, good luck.

Thanks, pazazz. I'll practice my ass off! xD And thanks for the link, will check it out now.

Anatomy is a tricky thing I always struggle with it too but what I found is the only way to learn it is to just keep drawing it. All the books say pretty much the same thing: Use references and shapes and all that is true. If you draw from real life then you'll start to understand how muscles work. Knowing where the muscles are and how they connect to the skeleton first really didn't help me at all. Anyone can memorize where all the muscles are but that doesn't mean they can draw it like a pro. The only way to learn how to draw is to draw. So my suggestion keep using refs all the time and do quick gestures and pretty soon it'll start clicking with how muscles and the bones work together.

One of the things that really helped me tighten up my UNDERSTANDING of anatomy and how a body moves... I picked up POSER, it's a 3D model and it was initially desgined to replace the wooden artist model. A lot of people just use it as a rendering device, but it's primary development was to be an artist's tool in learning all the multiple facets of the human body.

An artist's wooden dummy is very basic and does not give you muscle sinue, a 3D model does. You can use 360 degree camera angles and multiple light sources too, it's really helped me "SEE" just how a body moved and contorts.

You can get a free version from DAZ Studios. Try playing with a model, create your OWN "stock photos" in an environment you control, you get exactly what you want that way.

^_^

Jill; Yeah, I think I'll do just that, because.. I honestly just cannot see the point of learning how the skeleton works. To me, it looks like just another detour in learning.. I might be wrong, who knows, but that's what I'm thinking right now. Thanks for the reply! <3

Fable; WHOA, THANKS. O_O I sooo have to go get that thing! It sounds pretty much amazing! xD Thanks a lot for the comment!

Uh, Fablespinner, I'm a wee bit lost here. XDD; Did you mean that I should look for a program called "POSER" or should I download the Daz Studios program...? XDD; I don't wanna download the wrong thing.. :/

There is a lot of advice out there. But its plain and simple you can't draw what you do not know. If you want to draw a reallistic human form you must know what it can and can't do. Also , you must know what the parts look like. If you want to draw anime or a cartoon style its less important to know,but you still must know the basics.

There are many books out there and you will be surprised what we take for granted. Femal and male bone structures are different. But can you name how? Thats where anatomy comes in. Now, you don't need a college level anatomy class. You also don't need to pick up Grey's Anatomy Book. Something Simple as    The Anatomy Coloring Book   is very good.I recomend this book above the other because these are Basic line drawings. You can Learn about lighting and shadows seperately.  Its a High School Level Book. You can find it at Amazon in the used books for like $5.

Now, some tips how to use this. You don't need to do hours and hours of studying and learning what every single bone is named and where it goes. Buy a sketch book just for your anatomy. And for starters just sketch copy the pages. This helps you get a feel for it. Mind you you don't have to do the Organs, but they would help someone doing bloody zombie drawings. Concentrate on bone structure and Muscle structure. Most of theses once would be enough to get the basics and remember thats all you need. The ones that take a little more to sink in. Those you might need to do a few times. This you might find you need to do for the muscle structure on Face, legs and Back. Remember these are for you and not gonna be on public display. So write your notes. \

Example :  Female shoulder slope down. Male Shoulder are Straight.

When you are done you have refrences. When you draw something take a look back and review. Sooner or later these sketches will make sence and you will remember without looking back.

As you go on you will learnmore about the body. There are so many books out there pick one that most interest you. Remember If you have trouble drawing something Study its Basics, and they will get easier to draw.

On May 5, 2008 2:48 am, Jeica said:

POSER and DAZStudio are the same type of program... DAZ is freeware however. ^_^

WildeKarde: Aah, thanks.. Those notes do sound like they'll come in handy!

Whoa, I sure has gotten a loot of tips and hints in this thread.. A lot more than I thought I would! Thanks a lot, guys! It really helps and I really, really appreciate it!

Fablespinner; ....oh. *feels stupid* Man, I suck. XD; I'll get to downloading it this afternoon, then! Thanks, again. <3

Learning about  the human skeleton and muscle tissue helped me a lot.  I woulnd't write it off completely. 

You learn about what makes the body look the way it does in various positions.  Knowing that can help you when drawing free-hand as well as with a reference.  It especially helps when a reference is missing something I wish to add to my character. 

Everyone has given stellar advice.  Just keep moving forward.  And you are your own worst critic.  Like Ark said - don't be hard on yourself.  I have plenty of embaressing sketches and drawings from years past and I look at them when I feel down.  I've come a LONG way since then.

And Poser is a great tool.  I only recently obtained Poser 7.  Wow...

That's my two cents.

Thanks, Sliver. I'll keep your words in mind, ne.

*shakes head* So much to.. learn and.. practice.. x__x; It sometimes feels slightly overwhelming, but I'm already seeing some improvement, so whatever, haha. XD

Thanks again, guys. ;P

another fun thing to practice is to go to public places, sit down with your sketchbook, and doodle the people who walk past. what really helped me was to go to places like gyms for muscular types, and parks or zoos for normal types. for the big types I just sit down in a restaraunt. getting in to most of these places either doesn't cost much or is free. And most won't care if you loiter as long as you bribe them with sketches or buy something there. It's also a great way to learn how fabrics move. it doesn't matter if you get in a whole lot of detail either, just a rough sketch of what it generally looks like is enough. and focus on one peice of fabric, or one body part that seems like you've never drawn that before. take it slow, and don't rush. there's lots of poeple. I like going to the restaraunts myself, I can get a drink, sit down, and watch the children, or the adluts in their natural environments. also, drawing fat rolls may not seem like the prettiest art, but it helps alot actually. especially with the female body. if you learn how to draw extreme curves, you can tone them down a bit and make them very pretty. and no harm meant to anyone who is heavyset, most of my family and my friends are very big, so I sympathize with that problem.

Poser is awesome.  I have managed to improve my anatomy drawing by leaps and bounds thanks to Poser.  You can view a single figure or multiple figures from any angle you want.  It's great.  The version I have is called Poser Figure Artist, though it seems to have issues with Vista (runs, but is really slow -- could also just be my computer).  At any rate, it will make things a ton and a half easier for you.

The other thing I personally recommend is tracing, especially if you can get ahold of Poser and have access to a tablet.  It actually helps tremendously because the information on how things fit together will settle into your mind if you do it right. 

Here's step-by-step for what I did:

1. Take a model in Poser and position it how you like.  Don't do something too simple, but don't go too complex either.  Find a nice, dynamic pose and put it in an interesting angle (if I remember, I'll post an example)
2. Draw the "wireframe" setup.  You know, put the balls where joints are, a box for the chest, and lines for the straight parts of the arms and legs.  Do this on a layer above the original model.  Don't spend a lot of time here, just draw swift, light strokes that get the point across.  I tend to do this in light blue in Photoshop. (again, if I remember later, I'll post an example)
3. Using both the "wireframe" and the Poser model as a guide, flesh out the figure in a different color on another layer (I use purple).  You can add clothing to this layer or, using another layer and color, add the clothing on top -- either is fine.
4. Clean it up.  Use black and another layer on top and draw a cleaner version of the lineart.

Make sure you actually do the "wireframe" step because that, more than anything, is what will help you learn.  After a few months of doing Poser-traced wire drawings, I found that I could much more clearly see how body parts connected in different angles.  I still do this sometimes when I want to try a more complex pose and angle.  It's not completely infallible, but it's helped me tremendously.

If you don't have Poser/similar thing and a tablet, you can use photographs.  Find magazines, images online, even images in drawing books and trace them on a separate sheet of paper or make a photocopy and trace on that.  The concept is the same either way, but the important part is doing the wire drawing, since it provides the most basic understanding of where things go.

Cruffins; (...that made me think of chocolate muffins... hrm hrm.)

Yeah, I've done that a few times, it's really fun, haha! though, people looked at me like I was a stalker when I kept glancing at them and then down to my paper. XD I'll try it out some more. And, yeah, I've had the same thoughts about curny/heavyset women too.

Kaitou ; Ah, thanks for all the help! I'll download a poser program today and start practicing right away! :]

you're welcome! my name actually spawned of ie cream encased in muffin balls actually, but choco mufins work too.