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Traditional vs Digital
Posted: Apr 7, 2006 6:46 pm
# 1
So, I got into this weird argument with a 'art-elitist' the other day. The guy was saying that all traditional artwork (created with paints, colored pencils..etc) was better then all the digital artwork (created with Photoshop and the like). He said that digital artists were untalented since they use a program to create thier images. He went on ranting about how they should pick up a paintbrush and create art that way instead of using a computer mouse. I disagree!
Now if you ask me, you can't compare the traditional stuff to digital. With trad, you have to use 'real' mediums, and create your own colors. With digital, a program already has the colors, and the effects you can use.
Digital coloring (in my opinion) is often times more easier then trad since you got the 'undo' button, and the colors are already there, but you need to learn the program itself, which can take hours. I used to be a digital artist myself a while back. And I know it isn't as easy as it sounds..
To me, the whole 'trad vs digital' is alot simular to the 'music vs electronic music' argument. You can't exactly compare them both, since ther own ways of creating art is so different. Digital art (as with electronic music) itsn't always made by a bunch of lazy people as many elitists would say. It takes alot of smarts to know your tools (with d.art it's the art computer program, and with electro music it is the machines and equipment). As with trad art, all it really takes is creativity and a brillient mind. In fact, with digital art, you got more freedom and that can be fun!
I prefer traditional mediums myself though ![[emoticon]](http://www.paperdemon.com/images/forum/mysmilies/15pxyellow_smile.gif)
But thats just me XDD I just like to create artwork that I can put my hands on.
What do you guys think?
EDIT: Stupid spelling errors...aaaaarh xD
Last edited by Azzy on Apr 7, 2006 6:59 pm. Total edits: 2.
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Posted: Apr 7, 2006 8:42 pm
# 2
BogusRed
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This is a GREAT topic! Thank you for starting it Azzy.
Here's my take on it. It doesn't matter whether you are using digital or traditional mediums, an artist still needs to have the knowledge of composition, color, form, drawing skills, shadow, etc. The computer cannot do those things for you. The computer is mearly a tool, just as traditional mediums are. The computer is NO substitute for the creativety, skill and knowledge that an artist has. You still paint the same way with acrylics as you would in Photoshop. The only difference is less mess and less time spent mixing colors. You select paints to use, you can turn the paint into a wash (by adjusting opacity) and you can use assorted brush sizes and textures.
Even if Photoshop and other paint programs already have the colors there, the artist still has to have the skill to know the difference between value, saturation, and hue and which "paints" are good for the job.
Those that think digital artists are not real artists have a distorted, unrealistic view of computer paint programs and think the computer does all the work. They probably don't know that much about computers in the first place. In which case, they will be at a severe disadvantage if they ever decide to be an artist for a living.
Here's my take on it. It doesn't matter whether you are using digital or traditional mediums, an artist still needs to have the knowledge of composition, color, form, drawing skills, shadow, etc. The computer cannot do those things for you. The computer is mearly a tool, just as traditional mediums are. The computer is NO substitute for the creativety, skill and knowledge that an artist has. You still paint the same way with acrylics as you would in Photoshop. The only difference is less mess and less time spent mixing colors. You select paints to use, you can turn the paint into a wash (by adjusting opacity) and you can use assorted brush sizes and textures.
Even if Photoshop and other paint programs already have the colors there, the artist still has to have the skill to know the difference between value, saturation, and hue and which "paints" are good for the job.
Those that think digital artists are not real artists have a distorted, unrealistic view of computer paint programs and think the computer does all the work. They probably don't know that much about computers in the first place. In which case, they will be at a severe disadvantage if they ever decide to be an artist for a living.
Last edited by BogusRed on Apr 7, 2006 8:43 pm. Total edits: 1.
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Posted: Apr 7, 2006 9:05 pm
# 3
Yes! That is exactly what I ment...well maybe not exactly, but close! ^_^;;
I forgot to mention what you said about having knowledge about the basics of art! XD;; But yup, that's true. If you don't have much knowledge, it dosn't matter what you do trad, or digital, it still won't look good. And the same applies to music too. The next person who says that all digital art is untalented is going to get slap in the face xDD
Of course, I still think that both are almost uncomparable. I mean, air-brushing in real life is alot different compared to the digital version ![[emoticon]](http://www.paperdemon.com/images/forum/mysmilies/15pxyellow_laugh.gif)
It really sucks how ignorant those dumb art-elitists are! And yes, they even said that the computer does all the work for digital artists. The person who said that was one of my art teachers, who is a real phobia for technology and computers >___<;;;
They got thier advantages though! With digital, you can show your art online looking colorful and at full effect while the trad artists can show the stuff in real life without having a godly printer
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Posted: Apr 8, 2006 11:39 am
# 4
BogusRed
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Yeah I had a feeling we were thinking along the same lines. How come no one else has contributed to this discussion? This is a really good topic.
I'm not quite sure what you mean about the two being uncomparable though. If you use painter, you'll notice it is A LOT like traditional mediums. Expecially the oil paints.
I'm not quite sure what you mean about the two being uncomparable though. If you use painter, you'll notice it is A LOT like traditional mediums. Expecially the oil paints.
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Posted: Apr 8, 2006 5:16 pm
# 5
Well I was saying that both trad and digital are almost uncomparable because even though digital art can have the same effects of trad, the way you color isn't exactly the same! xD With traditional oil painting, you have to go through all this messy, tedious, paint mixing and drying while the oil paint on a computer program you don't. That is just my opinion though.
and umm...maybe people arn't here yet because it is a bit early? I'm sure someone will come along ^_^; I'm glad you like the topic though, and here I thought I was ranting about useless things that everyone would know ^_^;;
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Posted: Apr 8, 2006 5:26 pm
# 6
arkillian
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I think alot of it is jealosy of the popularity of digetal. It's like manga fanartists getting alot of attention- the people that don't draw it go "Well, is my art just crap now all of a sudden that artist is crap but gets more attention than me" (The irony of this is they sometime say this when the fan artist is beter ![[emoticon]](http://www.paperdemon.com/images/forum/mysmilies/15pxyellow_wink.gif)
)
Digetal art is the same as traditional art. It doesn't look good when un practised, but when practised can come up with some bold, and beutiful results. Paint and pencil have thier limitiations. it all depends on what you enjoy and have more creativity with
)Digetal art is the same as traditional art. It doesn't look good when un practised, but when practised can come up with some bold, and beutiful results. Paint and pencil have thier limitiations. it all depends on what you enjoy and have more creativity with
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Posted: Apr 8, 2006 5:47 pm
# 7
On Apr 8, 2006 5:26 pm, arkillian said:
I think alot of it is jealosy of the popularity of digetal. It's like manga fanartists getting alot of attention- the people that don't draw it go "Well, is my art just crap now all of a sudden that artist is crap but gets more attention than me" (The irony of this is they sometime say this when the fan artist is beter )
)This is true! There are people out there who get angery because of the popularity of digital-colored anime. In a way, I can see why they would be so ticked off though...it is because there are anime-art fans out there who go all "Art is boring unless it is DIGITAL ANIME!!!!!!" and only look at kind of art. It's...limiting.
Haha..this is cracking me up! Now that I think about it, I kind of used to be one of those whiners! I remember I used to draw INSANEILY detailed, moody, uber anime drawings (much like this- http://www.paperdemon.com/artview.php/id/5010.html ) but then nobody liked my art, instead, it was all the digital-colored, minimalistic chibis that had all the glory. I was so upset over it that I got depressed for like two long years, and then became a whimp when it came to critiques! ![[emoticon]](http://www.paperdemon.com/images/forum/mysmilies/15pxyellow_doh.gif)
Well, at least I didn't become a digital-art hater. I became an anime-fan/otaku hater. It is funny what jealiousy can do!
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Posted: Apr 8, 2006 5:54 pm
# 8
arkillian
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I'm much like you- You've seen my art? I put HOURS into my art and get little in reply on DA. Its cause noone is looking for your art, cause there is so much of other stuff they want to see. Most of the comments I get are from people that already watch me. I guess you need to make yourself known and people will spot you As soon as a good artist is advertised, their popularity soars cause people didn't know they existed till then. It's kind of sad really. That's why I like PD better. Everyone sees your art, and they aren't forced by the competition to base serching on what they want to see. A few hours and you can surf everyone's gallery
As soon as a good artist is advertised, their popularity soars cause people didn't know they existed till then. It's kind of sad really. That's why I like PD better. Everyone sees your art, and they aren't forced by the competition to base serching on what they want to see. A few hours and you can surf everyone's gallery ---
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Posted: Apr 8, 2006 9:56 pm
# 9
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everything on my mind has already been said in the previous posts, but I will add my two cents in about how much I hate art-elitists.
I really, really hate art-elitists.
That is all.
What really gets me annoyed is how the art-elitists will try and separate them. As was said, they are tools... you can mix tools together in art, too, just like how you can play violin in an electronica peice. Of course, they don't know that...
I really, really hate art-elitists.
That is all.
What really gets me annoyed is how the art-elitists will try and separate them. As was said, they are tools... you can mix tools together in art, too, just like how you can play violin in an electronica peice. Of course, they don't know that...
Posted: Apr 8, 2006 10:30 pm
# 10
arkillian
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On Apr 8, 2006 9:56 pm, Sugandya said:
What really gets me annoyed is how the art-elitists will try and separate them. As was said, they are tools.
What really gets me annoyed is how the art-elitists will try and separate them. As was said, they are tools.
Yeah, but you've got to realise that nothing beats having the feel of paint strokes under your finger tips. There is some things you can't do with 1s and 0s. Its the same with a keyboard organ. It sounds like a violin, but to hear a violin in real life played by someone that can play a violin is breath taking. This is what its like for a painter/pencil artist. To see the pencil/brush strokes and the texture? I can relate to this myself- I draw with pencil frequently for this reason. This doesn't mean that digetal should be disregraded by them. It's another way of doing it, and can come up with similarly stunning results. Please don't dis them for how they feel about it- they just aren't open minded, and you get people like that. They're the ones missing out on what digetal art can really be- not you
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Posted: Apr 9, 2006 2:20 am
# 11
fablespinner
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On Apr 7, 2006 8:42 pm, BogusRed said:
YOU HIT THAT NAIL RIGHT ON THE HEAD!
I use a tablet that works JUST like a brush would. Pressure sensitive, I stroke it like a brush I'm just not dipping it in a paint pot, I'm selecting (and mixing custom hues) from my pallete just like if I was holding one in my hand.
These "elitst" artists are the same ones that think you click a single button and VOILA PICASSO!
NOT
I still sit here DAYS ON END painting.
My canvas is just light on a screen rather than canvas.
It also improves hand eye coordination....
In real media you watch your hand paint
in digital? My eyes are on the screen and I cannot see my hand, I am watching my cursor.
That's a HUGE adaptation to using digital tools opposed to real media.
Let that elistest try it once, it's not as easy as he thinks it is.
Yes, there is an undo button....
ever hear of white out?
Same principal.
This is a GREAT topic! Thank you for starting it Azzy.
Here's my take on it. It doesn't matter whether you are using digital or traditional mediums, an artist still needs to have the knowledge of composition, color, form, drawing skills, shadow, etc. The computer cannot do those things for you. The computer is mearly a tool, just as traditional mediums are. The computer is NO substitute for the creativety, skill and knowledge that an artist has. You still paint the same way with acrylics as you would in Photoshop. The only difference is less mess and less time spent mixing colors. You select paints to use, you can turn the paint into a wash (by adjusting opacity) and you can use assorted brush sizes and textures.
Even if Photoshop and other paint programs already have the colors there, the artist still has to have the skill to know the difference between value, saturation, and hue and which "paints" are good for the job.
Those that think digital artists are not real artists have a distorted, unrealistic view of computer paint programs and think the computer does all the work. They probably don't know that much about computers in the first place. In which case, they will be at a severe disadvantage if they ever decide to be an artist for a living.
Here's my take on it. It doesn't matter whether you are using digital or traditional mediums, an artist still needs to have the knowledge of composition, color, form, drawing skills, shadow, etc. The computer cannot do those things for you. The computer is mearly a tool, just as traditional mediums are. The computer is NO substitute for the creativety, skill and knowledge that an artist has. You still paint the same way with acrylics as you would in Photoshop. The only difference is less mess and less time spent mixing colors. You select paints to use, you can turn the paint into a wash (by adjusting opacity) and you can use assorted brush sizes and textures.
Even if Photoshop and other paint programs already have the colors there, the artist still has to have the skill to know the difference between value, saturation, and hue and which "paints" are good for the job.
Those that think digital artists are not real artists have a distorted, unrealistic view of computer paint programs and think the computer does all the work. They probably don't know that much about computers in the first place. In which case, they will be at a severe disadvantage if they ever decide to be an artist for a living.
YOU HIT THAT NAIL RIGHT ON THE HEAD!
I use a tablet that works JUST like a brush would. Pressure sensitive, I stroke it like a brush I'm just not dipping it in a paint pot, I'm selecting (and mixing custom hues) from my pallete just like if I was holding one in my hand.
These "elitst" artists are the same ones that think you click a single button and VOILA PICASSO!
NOT
I still sit here DAYS ON END painting.
My canvas is just light on a screen rather than canvas.
It also improves hand eye coordination....
In real media you watch your hand paint
in digital? My eyes are on the screen and I cannot see my hand, I am watching my cursor.
That's a HUGE adaptation to using digital tools opposed to real media.
Let that elistest try it once, it's not as easy as he thinks it is.
Yes, there is an undo button....
ever hear of white out?
Same principal.
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Posted: Apr 9, 2006 2:39 am
# 12
arkillian
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On Apr 9, 2006 2:20 am, fablespinner said:
These "elitst" artists are the same ones that think you click a single button and VOILA PICASSO!
NOT
I still sit here DAYS ON END painting.
My canvas is just light on a screen rather than canvas.
It also improves hand eye coordination....
In real media you watch your hand paint
in digital? My eyes are on the screen and I cannot see my hand, I am watching my cursor.
That's a HUGE adaptation to using digital tools opposed to real media.
Let that elistest try it once, it's not as easy as he thinks it is.
Yes, there is an undo button....
ever hear of white out?
Same principal.
I hear you hon- There's alot of flexability with digetal than painting, and frankly, paint is difficult to master with mixing etc... and hinders your imagination to some extent cause of it. I have a book on how to mix colour. No joking. Actually, it's half fill on mixing, and the other chosing, but cgi has come up with oustanding art that is not only very commercial, but has the same depth as traditional style does. I don't agree for one second that it can look the same as traditional, but you can give an impression.
As for hanging a picture on the wall though, I'm affraid that it would take alot to convince me not to spend my money on a painting though. There's something very passionate about paint strokes on a canvas that makes me oggle a picture for ages trying to see how it was made. For this, I appreciate Traditional more, but I love looking at digetal for its clarity and other virtues it has.
These "elitst" artists are the same ones that think you click a single button and VOILA PICASSO!
NOT
I still sit here DAYS ON END painting.
My canvas is just light on a screen rather than canvas.
It also improves hand eye coordination....
In real media you watch your hand paint
in digital? My eyes are on the screen and I cannot see my hand, I am watching my cursor.
That's a HUGE adaptation to using digital tools opposed to real media.
Let that elistest try it once, it's not as easy as he thinks it is.
Yes, there is an undo button....
ever hear of white out?
Same principal.
I hear you hon- There's alot of flexability with digetal than painting, and frankly, paint is difficult to master with mixing etc... and hinders your imagination to some extent cause of it. I have a book on how to mix colour. No joking. Actually, it's half fill on mixing, and the other chosing, but cgi has come up with oustanding art that is not only very commercial, but has the same depth as traditional style does. I don't agree for one second that it can look the same as traditional, but you can give an impression.
As for hanging a picture on the wall though, I'm affraid that it would take alot to convince me not to spend my money on a painting though. There's something very passionate about paint strokes on a canvas that makes me oggle a picture for ages trying to see how it was made. For this, I appreciate Traditional more, but I love looking at digetal for its clarity and other virtues it has.
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Posted: Apr 9, 2006 7:10 am
# 13
Hmm... That's a tough one... I think traditional wins in my opinion, because then if you upload a scanned image of it, at least you have the original piece so u have the upper hand in an art theft situation. Plus I really don't know how to describe it... but i feel there's something "magical" in a way about traditional art. You can feel the energy that the artist has put into the piece (though i gotta say i do hate modern art, it majorly sucks, it's not art at all in my opinion)
Whereas Digital... there just isn't something right... It doesn't tell as much of a story as a real media piece. Yes you may get a digital piece to look better than any traditional piece, but isn't that mainly because you spend your time doing digital as opposed to working on traditional? plus theres all the filters, effects and undo buttons and such...
Anywayz, that's just my opinion in this debate. Someone who worked for Disney also said she preferred traditional because you can have the original infront of you, to feel the texture, see and sudy the beauty of it and even smell the paint/paper or whatever media you've used, whereas digital... you can't really do these.
Posted: Apr 9, 2006 2:38 pm
# 14
On Apr 9, 2006 7:10 am, Maz Bourne said:
Plus I really don't know how to describe it... but i feel there's something "magical" in a way about traditional art.
Yeah..thats the exact same way I think of it ![[emoticon]](http://www.paperdemon.com/images/forum/mysmilies/15pxyellow_=).gif)
There is something about creating art on an actual paper/canvas that makes it more special in comparision to creating art digitally. Of course, that is just me ^_^;
Or maybe it is because I am left-handed, and my right hand sucks at everything it does. I'm not even going to bother finding one of those 'left-handed' mouses either xD
Last edited by Azzy on Apr 9, 2006 2:39 pm. Total edits: 1.
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Posted: Apr 9, 2006 8:19 pm
# 15
arkillian
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On Apr 9, 2006 2:38 pm, Azzy said:
You're left handed? Wow- I couldn't imagine working with only my left hand. Mine can barely write let alone draw XD
Or maybe it is because I am left-handed, and my right hand sucks at everything it does. I'm not even going to bother finding one of those 'left-handed' mouses either xD
You're left handed? Wow- I couldn't imagine working with only my left hand. Mine can barely write let alone draw XD
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Posted: Apr 10, 2006 9:00 pm
# 16
My right hand is...dead. It can't do anything right! xD well, unless it's cutting with scissors, and even then I got to flip the scissors upside down to cut paper better ![[emoticon]](http://www.paperdemon.com/images/forum/mysmilies/15pxyellow_sweatdrop.gif)
Last edited by Azzy on Apr 10, 2006 9:00 pm. Total edits: 1.
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Posted: Apr 15, 2006 11:07 pm
# 17
Sugandya
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On Apr 8, 2006 10:30 pm, arkillian said:
?? I mean that those types dont seem to comprehend that natural and digital media can be mixed effortlessly and tend to separate them as if they both can't be married together. This is a bit outdated, but they're still out there.
Yeah, but you've got to realise that nothing beats having the feel of paint strokes under your finger tips. There is some things you can't do with 1s and 0s. Its the same with a keyboard organ. It sounds like a violin, but to hear a violin in real life played by someone that can play a violin is breath taking. This is what its like for a painter/pencil artist. To see the pencil/brush strokes and the texture? I can relate to this myself- I draw with pencil frequently for this reason. This doesn't mean that digetal should be disregraded by them. It's another way of doing it, and can come up with similarly stunning results. Please don't dis them for how they feel about it- they just aren't open minded, and you get people like that. They're the ones missing out on what digetal art can really be- not you
?? I mean that those types dont seem to comprehend that natural and digital media can be mixed effortlessly and tend to separate them as if they both can't be married together. This is a bit outdated, but they're still out there.
Last edited by Sugandya on Apr 15, 2006 11:13 pm. Total edits: 2.
Posted: Apr 16, 2006 10:24 am
# 18
Alright, here is my thoughts being that I'm a totally traditional artist.
Personally I've always worked with traditional medums. I love to do everything traditional because that's what I enjoy.
Now, I HAVE tried to do digital art and I suck at it. Now if I really wanted to learn it, I'm sure I could. But I really like doing everything traditional and that's where I'm going to stay.
I think they're an even split, personally. I know how hard both are becuase I've tried both. It's really not easy for me to do traditional art because I do mess it up. But, just like digital art, traditional art can be fixed.
Something Arkillian said to me when I said I just could not draw real people right was "Its also what you like to see yourself draw- obviously you don't enjoy drawing realism as much as you thought- I'd like to do anime, but my hearts not in it." As corney as I sound, I kind of stuck on that.
That guy is bashing digital art and I he's probably not even tried it. Digital vs. traditional or Anime vs. Realism, it all seems even to me. If you REALLY want to so something you can. This guy REALLY wants to do traditional and so he can. You, Azzy, can do digital because and i'm goint ot assume because that's what you really want to do.
So after this long rant that probably makes no sence at all my final statment is that I like digital just as much as traditional even tho I only do traditional. ^_^ (Tell me if I confused anyone.)
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Posted: Apr 17, 2006 5:31 pm
# 19
It really depends on my mood which I prefer. Overall, I'd say I like them both the same. With digital drawing there's the option of the undo button, gods bless! I was confused earlier in art class as to how to just undo, then I remembered that I'd have to errase. >.< The main thing I don't like about digital though is that I can't turn the piece when I draw; if I turn my tablet it just makes it worse. >.<
Posted: Apr 17, 2006 8:41 pm
# 20
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i prefer traditional art. It's not your work if you make it on a computer. If you draw it and show you can color on your own, thats real talent.
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